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From: Ilva
State of residence: DE
Subject: Apostle Paul
Date: 10-15-2008
I found it very interesting to find your comments regarding Apostle Paul may have been part of Herod's family. I am leading the discussion in Sunday School this coming Sunday from Acts 9 where Saul met Jesus on the road to Damascus.
I've been trying to understand who he was prior to being converted, why he would have been such a raging maniac against Christianity, what all the credentials would have meant to him (Phil 3) prior to conversion.
I'm not able to discuss with you in a very... ummm....logical/intelligent way... but I found your information very fascinating!!!
The way he met the Lord, the way he was changed, the way God used him.. he truly became a vessel chosen and fit for the Lord's use.
I suppose if I'm looking for a conversion experience like Saul had, I'd better be ready to have the shipwrecks/beatings, hunger/thirst, etc that he endures as well....
Thanks
Ilva
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From: JJR
Subject: Paul
Date: 10-17-2008
Thanks for the feedback Ilva. My theories are unconventional so they are not for everyone.
From: Linda
Residence: Illinois
Subject: Paul, Descendant of Herod
Date: 2-21-2010
Very interesting indeed, but I have noticed a flaw if you will. In the section you titled Paul of the tribe of benjamin, "Hebrew of Hebrews". Second paragraph. Many people get this confused. I will explain. All the tribes are called Israelites, all twelve. Their race and language were Hebrew. Only the tribe of Judah were called Jews. In the Old Testament, when the tribes divided into two nations. Northern and southern. The northern tribes were taken into captivity. The tribes in the south consisted of Judah the kingly line. Levites the priestly line and a small portion of the Manasseh tribe. My point is, all are Israelites, but not all are Jews. Only the tribe of Judah are Jews. Israel is their nation. Hebrew is their race and language. So when Paul says he is "Hebrew of Hebrews, he is bragging of sorts that he is fully one of them.
Also Paul was very zealous for the law. He sought out christians for that very reason. It wasn't till his conversion, that he had a change of heart about the law and implemented grace.
Another error I see is with Herod and the temple priests. Herod threw out all the priests (the ones that were supposed to be priests) and appointed who he wanted. At that time the priests, sadducees and pharisees were not of the tribe of levi as it should have been, so many were making their way into the group. I am not disputing that he may have been a relative of Herod's and that is how he got in to the Sanhedrin, but the Sanhedrin was not of the priestly line (Levi) during Herod's reign.
In the first Paragraph of "Hebrew of Hebrews". You say. "The tribe of benjamin gave the JEWS their first king, Saul". Benjamin gave the ISRAELITES their first king, which included the jews (tribe of Judah). All the tribes are Israelites but not all Israelites are Jews! Only the tribe of Judah is called Jews! There has been much confusion on this issue. Which has lead to many errors in history and in figuring out the New Testament.
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From: JJR
Subject: Response to Linda
Date: 2-21-2010
"Only the tribe of Judah were called Jews."
So in your opinion all the Kohanim priests are not Jews because they are not from the tribe of Judah? That's beyond ridiculous. Lost somewhere in there is a historical point about Samaria and the split between the northern and southern kingdoms. Yes, the Samaritans set up their own priesthood with their own temple on Mount Gerizim. The northern kingdom was conquered and many of it's people deported. The Hasmoneans later conquered Samaria, Galilee and Idumea destroying the Samaritan temple in the process. I would not contest an argument that Samaritans were not truly Jewish (reasonable minds could differ) but it does not follow from that point to a conclusion that one has to be of the tribe of Judah to be a Jew.
"The Benjamites did not merge into Judah, for they were a part of the northern kingdom that was taken away by the Assyrians."
Just flat out incorrect. The homeland of the tribe of Benjamin was in the south and included Jerusalem itself. The Benjamites were not taken away by the Assyrians when the northern kingdom fell. The priests of Levi prosecuted a campaign of ethnic cleansing against the Benjamites (the original royal tribe) nearly whipping them out of existence. Link.
"Another error I see is with Herod and the temple priests. Herod threw out all the priests (the ones that were supposed to be priests) and appointed who he wanted. At that time the priests, sadducees and pharisees were not of the tribe of levi as it should have been"
How can I put this kindly, bullshit. All Temple priests were of the tribe of Levi before, during and after Herod. Sadducees and Pharisees were religious parties that had no tribal requirement. One could be a member of any tribe and join the Pharisees or Sadducees. Yes, Herod appointed the high priest during his reign but that individual was always a Kohanim priest (meaning not only a member of the tribe of Levi but, also, a father to son descendant of Aaron).
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